Fuel consumption on 2014 Y61 ST Patrol 3.0 TD

[toucan]

Hello

I am a first timer to these forums and have two separate questions to ask which may or may not turn out to be related...

1. I have done around 1200 klms in my new patrol. All driving around the local area, so no long runs. I have fully filled the fuel tank twice now putting in 80 litres each time (fuel light comes on with 15 litres left in the tank). On the first occasion I got 479 klms out of the 80 litres and the second fill got 473 klms out of the 80 litres diesel. This equates to just under 6 litres per kilometres which I around half the performance I would have expected.

2. A few days ago or around 900 klms, I noticed a wirring/whooshing noise coming from the engine being transmitted through the snorkel. This noise is over and above the normal diesel engine chatter and much higher piched. I took the vehicle to the local Nissan dealer for its first service and to look at this noise. The head mechanic's diagnosis was that the noise was coming from the turbo charger. He recorded the noise on his Iphone with the intention of sending to the Nissan Engineers for an explanation of what can be done about it. I am awaiting a response.

I would appreciate any comment advice on these two issues and I am also wondering if they are linked in some way. Looking forward to replies.

Thanks

Toucan

[kevin07]

that's heavy on the fuel I would just say check that your odometer is reading correct the noise sorry cant help

[Clunk]

So that's about 16.7lt/100km........is that manual or auto? Mostly short stop start driving? Revving the nuts off it or driving miss Daisy?

[4bye4]

Hello

I am a first timer to these forums and have two separate questions to ask which may or may not turn out to be related...

1. I have done around 1200 klms in my new patrol. All driving around the local area, so no long runs. I have fully filled the fuel tank twice now putting in 80 litres each time (fuel light comes on with 15 litres left in the tank). On the first occasion I got 479 klms out of the 80 litres and the second fill got 473 klms out of the 80 litres diesel. This equates to just under 6 litres per kilometres which I around half the performance I would have expected.

2. A few days ago or around 900 klms, I noticed a wirring/whooshing noise coming from the engine being transmitted through the snorkel. This noise is over and above the normal diesel engine chatter and much higher piched. I took the vehicle to the local Nissan dealer for its first service and to look at this noise. The head mechanic's diagnosis was that the noise was coming from the turbo charger. He recorded the noise on his Iphone with the intention of sending to the Nissan Engineers for an explanation of what can be done about it. I am awaiting a response.

I would appreciate any comment advice on these two issues and I am also wondering if they are linked in some way. Looking forward to replies.

Thanks

Toucan

That is pretty high fuel usage. Just a wild guess, but is it possible that there is something loose or partially blocking the air intake system which is what you can hear? I can't hear the noise so just a guess. I'm not sure about turbine noise (from the turbo charger) coming back through the intercooler and air filter into the snorkel.
I once had a plastic bag get sucked into the intake on my work truck, not the 4x4, and it choked the system causing a rushing sound in the air intake and black smoke from exhaust. Motor kept running though and I guess if I hadn't noticed the smoke and lack of performance, my fuel usage would have gone through the roof.
Tony

[toucan]

Thanks for responses. To answer them .... Driving has mostly been around town, some stop/start the rest driving 10-20k's without stop.

I know the noise relates to the turbo charger as the mechanic disengaged the small rubber hose from it and the noise stopped straight away. However he could not explain it, hence recording the noise and sending it off to Nissan. I guess my first concern is really the fuel used as even for running around town I would have expected 20% better. Bit alarming really.

Thanks

Toucan

[toucan]

Sorry, In reply to Clunk, driving miss daisy most of the time.

Thanks

toucan

[threedogs]

16.7 per 100 would be your towing figures,
surely the MAF wouldn't require cleaning being so young.
All snorkles on TD diesels will make a bit of a racket
thats the noise of forced induction, nothing to worry about at all

[the evil twin]

Sorry, In reply to Clunk, driving miss daisy most of the time.

Thanks

toucan

CRD's don't like that style, generally they are much happier if driven with a bit of welly

You will generally get better economy around town if you get them up above about 2200 RPM and work up the gears to traffic speed relatively quickly and get into a high gear as soon as conditions permit... without flooring it everywhere obviously.

16's is crap and it does seem like you have an issue so I would let Nissan work thru it.
There are some rogue CRD's that do suck fuel however, again 16's is still way high.

Most CRD's average around 12's over extended periods and varied use, IE city/country/some 4WD/bit of towing.

I cannot recommend highly enough that you purchase a Scangauge to assist in seeing where the fuel and power sweet spots are as well as the many other advantages of the Units

[toucan]

Thanks

Mine is an Auto model. I expect a little worse performance but not to the extent that I am experiencing.

Toucajn

[Clarkie]

Hi Toucan,
I have a 2014 ST in auto and off the initial 80ltrs (when fuel light illuminates) I have completed 610kms.
This is with bull bar, winch, spotlights and roof rack. (Titanium edition ).
Vehicle has less than 2500kms
My maths could be garbage but I think that's 13.1L/100kms.
Mainly M7 to work and back. AIR CON old man style driving.

Hope this helps

Cheers
Dave

[toucan]

Thanks Dave

I would be happy with the 610k's. Mine is also a Titanium edition.

Cheers

Toucan

[toucan]

Just filled up and changing driving style to see what I can get.

Thanks

toucan

[threedogs]

Hard to believe driving faster will improve fuel economy.
Will be interested in your next report

Even towing sitting on 110kph I get over 600k's from the main tank

[the evil twin]

Don't drive faster as such... just get the engine in the torque band quickly and get into the highest gear then just lope along.

Work trip for me was 70 K's round trip, maybe 15 sets of lights, about 1/2 of it 80 KPH zone.
I used to get 10.5 ish LPH in the morning and 11.0 ish in the arvo (hotter and hellish headwinds usually).
That was on the Scan guage which was calibrated very accurately to +/- 1%
That's turning 33's, EGR blocked, DP chip on 8, no NADS, factory I'cooler and a damn heavy truck with all the fruit it had onboard.

You can't let the CRD's lug, ever.
They can't pull the skin off custard below 2,000
All they do is blow Diesel out the exhaust and go even slower

[Clarkie]

hey Toucan,

Just filled up:

Trip meter: 816kms
Fuel in: 114Ltrs

13.9L/100Kms
7.19Km/L

Main: 610km
Sub: 206km

Distance to empty (estimated): 79Km

Effective Range: 895Km

Driving Style: 50% M7/5/4/2/1, 50% suburban driving. (sedate wth air con)

[threedogs]

Tyre size has a lot to do with it to.
OE 265s will return the best figures go up a size expect an increase of 1 to 2 ltr per 100 K's.
Also what tread pattern as well A HWY stlye tread like a cooper ATR will be better than a full on Mud pattern style tyre
This is for 16" rims

@ ET having the chip on 8 have you noticed black smoke more than usual,
Think mine is on 7 just for that reason

[the evil twin]

@ ET having the chip on 8 have you noticed black smoke more than usual,
Think mine is on 7 just for that reason

Actually, now you mention it mine may have been on 7 as well, can't quite recall now and have sold her a while back.
I think Doggy may have had it on 8 when I bought it off him, but, could be wrong about that as well.

[paulyg]

If you have 33 inch tyres would it be worth regearing to? mine is an auto 4.3 next one down is 4.6, would that be to low with 33 inch tyres?

[shina]

Don't stress too much mate. Mines a 2013 ST manual brought it new and thought the same thing the economy was crap but it does get better as the motor wears in and you start to get a few mor k's on it. I now have around 20,000k's on it bullbar, roofbasket, dual battery, snorkel and power chip on it. Don't ask me how many litres per 100 because ive never been home long enough to see a fuel tank through it lately and work it out but from memory the last time i did see a full mains tank it was get up around the 1000k's. If i do this time home i'll let you know what it comes in at.

Cheers Shane

[toucan]

Don't stress too much mate. Mines a 2013 ST manual brought it new and thought the same thing the economy was crap but it does get better as the motor wears in and you start to get a few mor k's on it. I now have around 20,000k's on it bullbar, roofbasket, dual battery, snorkel and power chip on it. Don't ask me how many litres per 100 because ive never been home long enough to see a fuel tank through it lately and work it out but from memory the last time i did see a full mains tank it was get up around the 1000k's. If i do this time home i'll let you know what it comes in at.

Cheers Shane

Thanks fellas for all the discussion. Have filled tank twice since original post putting in 80 litres both times. Result 498klms and 493 klms respectively. Been trying to keep engine revs above 2000. Taking vehicle for long drive next week to see if that improves the situation. Got 2000k's on clock now.

Toucan

[threedogs]

I take it you have checked tyre pressures and you have OE tyres and rims fitted

[toucan]

I take it you have checked tyre pressures and you have OE tyres and rims fitted

Tyres are Bridgestone 697 Duellers 275/65R17's Running at 38-40psi.

toucan

[Hodge]

That was on the Scan guage which was calibrated very accurately to +/- 1%
That's turning 33's

@the evil twin

Hey ET. Just wondering how you got your Scangauge really accurate? I'm about to start following bellow instructions from scratch.
For 33" did you set your speed setting +3% or there abouts? And for the second fill-up, how religiously do you have to follow the filling up when tank is at 1/4 rule ?? Since there is 2 tanks. 125L total, it's hard to gauge what exactly is a quarter.

I started this process ages ago then, just forgot about it, so gonna reset and start fresh.


http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=53909&stc=1http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=53910&stc=1

[the evil twin]

The 1/4 tank isn't critical.
They just want you to use a decent amount of fuel to help get it more accurate.
Keep an eye on what it says over the next few tanks after the 2nd fill as well and if it is consistently low or high you can tweak it a tad more.
I used to fill my truck from an empty sub and 1/4ish main (long range) so it would take 110 to 125 odd litres.
There are variables from pump to pump but it should be within about a litre or maybe two at the most and over several fills it should average out.

My Scangauge fuel % setting for my Patrol was +9.7%
That was with a DP Chip set on 7 or maybe 8 can't quite remember.

I can't remember what the speed compensation % was but that is easy to set.
Just set it to agree with a GPS or SatNav it will be different for almost any truck due to tyre diameter and wear.

You need to have both fuel and speed corrections set correctly to get the best accuracy

[Hodge]

THanks a lot for that mate. Give me a better idea. See I didnt even know about the fuel setting either... And as I have a dyno tuned uni chip i wouldnt have a clue where to set it at.

[bowerbird]

my 2011 CRD, hardly tows and from new it gets 16 ish. its an auto and I drive normally. It does produce some smoke accelerating away even gentle acceleration. I am interested to see how running higher rpm is going to improve fuel economy?

[Hodge]

I can't remember what the speed compensation % was but that is easy to set.
Just set it to agree with a GPS or SatNav it will be different for almost any truck due to tyre diameter and wear.

Calibrated mine today and is surprised me. My scangauge is at +12% and is more or less spot on with the GPS speed. TO confirm I tested with 2 GPS devices and both were identical. This surprised me, as my dash tacho is out by about 3km. SO when it shows 97, i'm doing a 100. I just assumed the scangauge then would be 3%.
But I got to 12% before it actually began showing the right speed. Interesting. This means whatever fuel stuff it was showing me thus far, was more 12% out ???

[the evil twin]

Calibrated mine today and is surprised me. My scangauge is at +12% and is more or less spot on with the GPS speed. TO confirm I tested with 2 GPS devices and both were identical. This surprised me, as my dash tacho is out by about 3km. SO when it shows 97, i'm doing a 100. I just assumed the scangauge then would be 3%.
But I got to 12% before it actually began showing the right speed. Interesting. This means whatever fuel stuff it was showing me thus far, was more 12% out ???

Depending on the fuel calibration as well then not necessarily 12% but, yes, it will have been out previously.

'Genuine' 33's over 'genuine' 31's will increase actual vehicle speed and therefore distance covered per revolution by over 6%.
For the same speedo reading of 97 with 33's doing 100 actual if you had 31's at 97 on the speedo you would have been doing 94 ish actual.

Be aware that Odometers are not directly coupled to the Speedo and if a Speedo is out say 10% that does not mean the Odo is out by the same amount, indeed, the Odo is usually more accurate than the speedo due to teh vagaries of ADR compliance and the calibration procedures.

Now that the speed data from the ECU to your Scangauge has the compensation factor applied it now knows how far you are really travelling.
When the fuel useage compensation is corrected it then knows how much fuel is being used from the ECU injector open timing.
There is no standard figure because Chips, dirty injectors, differing fuel rail pressures etc etc all mean that each vehicle will be slightly different.

[Hodge]

Well explained mate as always. Cheers!

[HappyCamper*]

Hi Toucan , I also have the 2014 Titanium ( well its the wifes car ) & tow a 1.6 ton camper trailer , Just done 3200 odd clicks down to Tamworth & all the national parks & trails there & back we could fit in ( total of 6700km odd on clock ) . Worked out to be a average of 23.8 liters per 100 kilometer . We are back home last night & have booked it in to Nissan this morning . They cant fit it in until next Tuesday ( I will let you know the out come ) .

[threedogs]

at the Doctors today I was reading a piece on best 10 towing 4x4s, {i take all my old mags there}
anyway a CRD towing 2 tonne returned figures of 18ltrs per 100 Ks

[Clarkie]

Thanks fellas for all the discussion. Have filled tank twice since original post putting in 80 litres both times. Result 498klms and 493 klms respectively. Been trying to keep engine revs above 2000. Taking vehicle for long drive next week to see if that improves the situation. Got 2000k's on clock now.

Toucan

Latest update from mostly a range of driving styles/environments

[Hodge]

Without starting a new thread.. To those with scangauge 2. Has this ever happened to you?
I filled up, went to press the fill up button on the scan gauge as I normally do. And this is the initial number of liters I got. So I had to sit there and make it go down to 110l which mind you took a while. .. Any guesses ??



54830

Sent from my S4 using Forum Runner

[Hodge]

Without starting a new thread.. To those with scangauge 2. Has this ever happened to you?
I filled up, went to press the fill up button on the scan gauge as I normally do. And this is the initial number of liters I got. So I had to sit there and make it go down to 110l which mind you took a while. .. Any guesses ??



54830

Sent from my S4 using Forum Runner

This thing has done it to me again. I'm guessing faulty ScanGauge... If I reset it completely I will lose all settings and data collected this far.
Very annoying.

[kevin07]

Thanks for responses. To answer them .... Driving has mostly been around town, some stop/start the rest driving 10-20k's without stop.

I know the noise relates to the turbo charger as the mechanic disengaged the small rubber hose from it and the noise stopped straight away. However he could not explain it, hence recording the noise and sending it off to Nissan. I guess my first concern is really the fuel used as even for running around town I would have expected 20% better. Bit alarming really.

Thanks

Toucan
mine did this exactly the same I was thinking turbo as well but it was exhaust manifold leak as well as flange under turbo. may isay try listening with a screw driver or hose around the exhaust manifold and or use some talcum powder and see if it blows.

[Hodge]

Got the best economy I've ever recorded this morning.

800 when light came up, so about 14l left in tank. I'm impressed.

55697

Sent from my S4 using Forum Runner

[threedogs]

Got the best economy I've ever recorded this morning.

800 when light came up, so about 14l left in tank. I'm impressed.

55697

Sent from my S4 using Forum Runner

auto/manual and what size tyres please
I take it thats both tanks OE size

[Hodge]

Both tanks OE mate. 95 and 30. Running on 33" tyres.

I should have said best recorded since roof rack and awning went up. I used to get much more. Roof rack dragged it down immensely.

Sent from my S4 using Forum Runner

[threedogs]

Still not bad I found a roof rack will drag about 30-40ks per tank, sound right to you

[Hodge]

Still not bad I found a roof rack will drag about 30-40ks per tank, sound right to you

Yeah this is not bad I think. These Ks are roughly 60% highway, 40% , usual city driving below 70 etc...

[threedogs]

I go from full to half tank and then when the light comes on .
I think half tank its 340ish and 600 when the light comes on

[Blindsided]

Exactly the same thing happened to my friend's 3L CRD in the Vic High Country last year. We couldn't identify the source at the time.

[Col.T]

G'day Toukie,
gotta go with the evil one.
Your K's/l are not good.
My numbers over about 9 years of a crd3.0 average 8.0 or better. I don't like turbos, much prefer the low rev grunt of the old 4.2 but my results now are close to 8.0 and better rather than the 6.0.you're getting. Don't rev the guts out of it as although it'll go like the clappers, it'll suck like crazy. I reckon about 500 to 1000 RPM more than a non turbo is optimal between gear changes and that is about say 2750 or even maybe 3000.
Assuming your 'new' Patrol is a new one, I'd be keeping your consumption records (for the rest of your life) and working through what appears to be a clear problem with the dealer.
All the best,
Col.

[stevemc181]

I'm suffering from pretty heavy fuel consumption figures in my new 2016 GU Y61. The best I have gotten is 17.3lph, the worst is 18lph. Mostly standard suburban driving with the odd highway run thrown in. I've only measured it over 4 tankfuls so far. My ODO is out by 7.3% with the 33" Mickey T's on, so I've accounted for this when working out litres consumed vs kilometre travelled.
Vehicle weighs 2600kg and is fitted with a Roofrack and Bar, to contrast this, my Pajero is heavier at 2850kg, and also has a roof rack, I average around 12-13lph mixed driving with it and the same type of tyres but in 32", so the Patrol is using substantially more. Is this normal? I was expecting maybe 14-15lph, but not 17lph+. I am not driving like a hoon but I don't baby it either, and sit on the 110 speed limit on the hwy. I'm not chasing uber fuel economy, but this is pretty thirsty for a 3.0 litre diesel I think.

[threedogs]

What tread pattern and tyre pressures are you running around town.
When was the last time you serviced the MAF and air filter.
17 does sound a tad high, I get 15/100 towing......

[Hodge]

I'm suffering from pretty heavy fuel consumption figures in My new 2016 GU Y61. The best I have gotten is 17.3lph, the worst is 18lph. Mostly standard suburban driving with the odd highway run thrown in. I've only measured it over 4 tankfuls so far. My ODO is out by 7.3% with the 33" Mickey T's on, so I've accounted for this when working out litres consumed vs kilometre travelled.
Vehicle weighs 2600kg and is fitted with a Roofrack and Bar, to contrast this, my Pajero is heavier at 2850kg, and also has a roof rack, I average around 12-13lph mixed driving with it and the same type of tyres but in 32", so the Patrol is using substantially more. Is this normal? I was expecting maybe 14-15lph, but not 17lph+. I am not driving like a hoon but I don't baby it either, and sit on the 110 speed limit on the hwy. I'm not chasing uber fuel economy, but this is pretty thirsty for a 3.0 litre diesel I think.

Seems a tad excessive...
For what it's worth Steve. I had a 2009 CRD. 33" Mickey T. P3's on steel rims (identical to what I have on my 4.2 now). Roof rack. Bull bar. Winch. Usual mods. 2.75" exhaust system. I had a Uni chip dyno tuned to the car and I was getting 13-15" with a ton of power under foot. I ran up to the high country a lot fully loaded with camping gear and was still getting around 15-16 for those drives...

[stevemc181]

What tread pattern and tyre pressures are you running around town.
When was the last time you serviced the MAF and air filter.
17 does sound a tad high, I get 15/100 towing......

I run 40psi in Mickey T P3 ATZ, Haven't had any servicing apart form the initial 1000km service, I've only done a tad over 2000kms from brand new, hasn't seen a dirt road yet.


Seems a tad excessive...
For what it's worth Steve. I had a 2009 CRD. 33" Mickey T. P3's on steel rims (identical to what I have on my 4.2 now). Roof rack. Bull bar. Winch. Usual mods. 2.75" exhaust system. I had a Uni chip dyno tuned to the car and I was getting 13-15" with a ton of power under foot. I ran up to the high country a lot fully loaded with camping gear and was still getting around 15-16 for those drives...

I've just returned this afternoon from a 200km round trip to Northam just out of Perth, and have decided I am going to exhaust and chip or tune it. Its just too much of a slug in its current form for me to enjoy any highway driving in it. Uphill overtaking lanes where I could boot the Paj fully loaded and easily overtake, I now have to sit in the traffic and am barely able to maintain a constant speed. I had heard it seems to be a bit hit and miss with the CRD's regarding fuel economy and I was expecting a bit of a power drop, but not to this extent. I'll have a chat to the Nissan Dealer, but if they are anything like Mitsubishi it will be lip service only from them.

[Clunk]

Its not run in yet, bury the pedal and give it some

[stevemc181]

Its not run in yet, bury the pedal and give it some

Yep, I'll give it a few thousand more km's and see if it improves. The Paj has an Infinitech ECU Tune which I'm happy with and I notice they also do a package for the CRD Patrol with 3" Exhaust and ECU Dyno Tune fitted for $2295.00. I'm heading down their way on Wednesday so will drop in and have a chat and see where negotiation gets me ;) Regardless of the engine loosening up a bit with a few more km's, its gunna need more power :driving2: I can live with heavy fuel use, but I can't live with heavy fuel use and a lack of grunt.

[threedogs]

Yep, I'll give it a few thousand more km's and see if it improves. The Paj has an Infinitech ECU Tune which I'm happy with and I notice they also do a package for the CRD Patrol with 3" Exhaust and ECU Dyno Tune fitted for $2295.00. I'm heading down their way on Wednesday so will drop in and have a chat and see where negotiation gets me ;) Regardless of the engine loosening up a bit with a few more km's, its gunna need more power :driving2: I can live with heavy fuel use, but I can't live with heavy fuel use and a lack of grunt.

Go for the re-map over the chip on the CRD better bang for buck IMO

[Hodge]

Go for the re-map over the chip on the CRD better bang for buck IMO

How so John ? With a chip, if something isnt right, you unplug it and its back to factory like it never was there. Especially with a car under warranty...
ECU tune something goes wrong... You're stranded.

[threedogs]

Twotrollfam had it done and swore by it . like anything if it breaks it breaks
A re-map IMO cant fail as there are no moving parts.
With the Patrol still under warranty I wouldnt touch it
Id drive it like it was stolen and wait for something to break lol

[Bacho86]

Go for the re-map over the chip on the CRD better bang for buck IMO


How so John ? With a chip, if something isnt right, you unplug it and its back to factory like it never was there. Especially with a car under warranty...
ECU tune something goes wrong... You're stranded.

I agree with Hodge, you have to be really carefully just saying remap is better as there is a lot more to it and the chip st least provides a fall back position if you're out in the middle of no where, you can remove the chip and continue under factory settings.

A Remap to my knowledge offer no fall back position, so you really need to choose your remap tuner very carefully if you want to proceed down this path .


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[Bacho86]

I'm suffering from pretty heavy fuel consumption figures in my new 2016 GU Y61. The best I have gotten is 17.3lph, the worst is 18lph. Mostly standard suburban driving with the odd highway run thrown in. I've only measured it over 4 tankfuls so far. My ODO is out by 7.3% with the 33" Mickey T's on, so I've accounted for this when working out litres consumed vs kilometre travelled.
Vehicle weighs 2600kg and is fitted with a Roofrack and Bar, to contrast this, my Pajero is heavier at 2850kg, and also has a roof rack, I average around 12-13lph mixed driving with it and the same type of tyres but in 32", so the Patrol is using substantially more. Is this normal? I was expecting maybe 14-15lph, but not 17lph+. I am not driving like a hoon but I don't baby it either, and sit on the 110 speed limit on the hwy. I'm not chasing uber fuel economy, but this is pretty thirsty for a 3.0 litre diesel I think.

As others have mentioned the vehicle is still new and may get better once it's run in, however they do seem to be hit and miss with CRD fuel economy

Not sure if you mentioned it earlier, but is the vehicle auto or manual?

My auto normally averages 15-16 l/100 km which isn't great, but learnt to live with it.

I remember some advice from ET a number of years ago where he said in his experience these engines prefer to get up to speed quickly and then maintain the speed, as opposed to slowing accelerating and labouring them under 2000rpm


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[Bacho86]

Twotrollfam had it done and swore by it . like anything if it breaks it breaks
A re-map IMO cant fail as there are no moving parts.
With the Patrol still under warranty I wouldnt touch it
Id drive it like it was stolen and wait for something to break lol

Berrimer diesel just posted an interesting video on Facebook regarding remapping vs plug in chips on, I'll try and link it in here

https://www.facebook.com/berrimadiesel/videos/1332636283446601/


http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/03/234.jpg

http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/images/imported/2017/03/235.jpg


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